Royal Navy Submarines To Accept Women Sailors For First Time


The Huffington Post UK First Posted: 8/12/11 11:36 GMT Updated: 8/12/11 11:36 GMT


Women will be allowed to serve on Royal Navy submarines for the first time in British history, the defence secretary has announced.

In a speech to the Royal United Service Institute (RUSI) on Thursday, Philip Hammond said the first women are due to join the navy's submarine service in 2013.

"I can announce today that I have accepted the recommendation of the first sea lord that women should be allowed to serve in submarines in the future," he said, adding that the armed forces should not be "slaves to tradition".

"Female officers will serve on the Vanguard submarines from late in 2013, followed by ratings in 2015. Women, officers and ratings, will also be able to serve on the Astute class submarines from about 2016."

The decision comes following an 18-month review conducted by the Royal Navy looking at the legal, operational, health, social, technical, and financial issues of allowing women to serve on submarines

Women had previously been excluded from submarine roles due to concerns about higher levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere carrying risks to female health.

In a statement issued this morning the MoD admitted that this was "unfounded" and that there were no medical reasons for excluding women from service in submarines.

According to the MoD over than 9% of Royal Navy personnel are female, approximately 3,420. Women have been serving on board Royal Navy ships since 1990.

But those joking about women's driving skills on Twitter this morning should probably think twice, given a series of embarrassing incidents with men at the helm.

In one instance HMS Astute, the Navy's newest and most powerful submarine, ran aground soon after its launch. The rescue tug sent to save the submarine then also crashed into her, tearing off one of her fins.

In 2009 HMS Vanguard and the French submarine Le Triomphant narrowly avoided a disaster after they crashed into each other in the Atlantic.

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But those joking about women's driving skills on Twitter this morning

Can you believe that stupid shit still gioes on? This while people have been whining that offering lower insurance to women is discriminatory. Just goes to show how misogynistic attitudes persist even when the myths are thoroughly debunked.

Originally Posted by contracycle

But those joking about women's driving skills on Twitter this morning . Can you believe that stupid shit still goes on?

Yes. From my pov, the real question is whether they're funny jokes or not, meant as innocent ribbing or actually meant to hurt and demean... OTOH, you could make the same argument as with the thread on racism. Joking about/insulting women is made illegal.

Quote:

This while people have been whining that offering lower insurance to women is discriminatory.

That was always stupid. The only question to answer on this is how much do we allow insurance companies to discriminate between customers? If it's okay to discriminate (positively) on gender, can we do the same on age, eye sight, training etc?

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Originally Posted by Gilles de Rais

Yes. From my pov, the real question is whether they're funny jokes or not, meant as innocent ribbing or actually meant to hurt and demean.

"It's only a joke" is right up there with "Some of my best friends are black".

The problem being that both of them can actually be true rather than just belated attempt to remove the sting from an insult...

Do you recognise any joke as permissible or is it a case that, as soon as it might conceivably offend anyone, it's off limit? I mean, what about jokes about the Pope? Some of my best friends are Catholics, you know...

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US still hasn't opened it's subs to female enlisted sailors although they said a few officers who happen to have vaginas are now allowed on the larger nuclear subs.

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Give unto Caesar that what is Caesar's, and lie like hell to keep as much of the rest of your shit as you can.

"If you want something said ask a man...if you want something done, ask a woman" Margaret Thatcher

& really fuck the Navy, the Army is way worse, all combat arms branches even fucking field artillery are closed to women, so are special forces, and combat diving, and seals, and rangers.

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Give unto Caesar that what is Caesar's, and lie like hell to keep as much of the rest of your shit as you can.

"If you want something said ask a man...if you want something done, ask a woman" Margaret Thatcher

Originally Posted by Gilles de Rais

The problem being that both of them can actually be true rather than just belated attempt to remove the sting from an insult...

And neither of them make any difference, even if they are true.

Quote:

Do you recognise any joke as permissible or is it a case that, as soon as it might conceivably offend anyone, it's off limit? I mean, what about jokes about the Pope? Some of my best friends are Catholics, you know...

I don't give a fig for "offence". I care about bigotry. It doesn't matter if anyone is there to be "offended" - that is wholly irrelevent.

But how can you tell a joke from bigotry? If I make a joke on the Pope, it's probably fine. If the same joke is told by a Northern Irish protestant, is it the same thing?

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Originally Posted by LiberalNation

US still hasn't opened it's subs to female enlisted sailors although they said a few officers who happen to have vaginas are now allowed on the larger nuclear subs.

Originally Posted by LiberalNation

& really fuck the Navy, the Army is way worse, all combat arms branches even fucking field artillery are closed to women, so are special forces, and combat diving, and seals, and rangers.

You really don't see the extra potential dangers for women in combat units both from their own teammates and, unlikely as it might be, from the enemies, if they ever were captured?

I mean, technically, I am fine if they are volunteers. They want to move ahead in their careers and they know the risks, fine. But to pretend there is no issue is a bit unusual...

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Out of interest,how exactly do you go about capturing a nuclear submarine and imposing upon the chastity of its inhabitants? I already have a snorkel and a tin-opener.

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